Content Creators Need Your Feedback.

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Toastdroid
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Re: Content Creators Need Your Feedback.

Post by Toastdroid » Mon Nov 26, 2018 12:49 am

I promised I was not gonna get involved in this slugfest but, nah, gonna have to, thoughts on it have been stewing.

I've happily provided feedback to producers who have asked for it, and I've even done a couple reviews for stuff I thought was a little too obscure, and knowing that I find it frankly somewhat insulting to suggest that lack of feedback is what is "driving away" content producers.

Honestly to begin with I am highly skeptical of that, cause to be honest and strictly in the scope of paid adult content there is actually more stuff getting made now than the norm (I'm not saying whether most of that is good, but still). I'm not sure whether people actually notice this because to be honest people here tend to hyperfixate on a handful of models to - I suspect - the detriment of all others (not gonna call judgement on that, just how I perceive it). On another note I'd like to dispute the notion that Evangelion Winter has been "cranking out tons of stuff lately" since they've in fact just been re-releasing older clips in HD (which is a good thing but it's hardly new stuff).

But even if that were not the case, these people are professionals, this is their job, and the reason they drop out from making this stuff is that other stuff makes more money for them. You want to know why Ashley Fires stopped making robot stuff? Because she found something that paid more. And that's 100% totally fine, I do not blame people in an industry as volatile as sex work to seek greener pastures. "We" are too small of an interest group to totally support people monetarily and socially. I honestly can't believe I have to say that, because I thought it was obvious. Do not assume people that make porn for you are your friends, because it's unhealthy and demanding to do so.

If this was just a "hey, it'd be nice if you gave ratings to stuff you like on sites that allow it, cause it helps models' promote themselves, if you can" I wouldn't have any problem, if it were "hey, if a model asks you directly for feedback, let 'em know when you have time" that'd also be fine, but it's totally unfair to both demand feedback and also blame people who have already paid money for not providing it, completely unprompted, especially when there are a ton of people on here, including myself, making content for free without that expectation (which honestly if I wanted I would actually go elsewhere for, because there are far more active groups around this stuff than here).

If you really want to tell a model how you like this stuff, and for them to keep making it, commission them, hell commission more people who haven't done this stuff before if you want it to be more widespread (there's a ton of models out there now, some do customs for as low as 40 bucks for 10 minutes, c'mon). Do not hold others responsible for your own lack of content. It is patronizing to do so to with an emoticon laden post and it is patronizing to try and dictate how people engage in their interests and how they manage their relationships within those interests.

Okay I think I'm done, that's a frankly ridiculous amount of words about niche robot pornography.

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Re: Content Creators Need Your Feedback.

Post by daphne » Mon Nov 26, 2018 1:22 am

Toastdroid wrote:it's totally unfair to both demand feedback and also blame people who have already paid money for not providing it, completely unprompted
This is my main beef as well. Like, you already got paid, bruh. You need me to give you a pep talk on top of that? I'm not your therapist.

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Re: Content Creators Need Your Feedback.

Post by Kano » Mon Nov 26, 2018 10:19 am

Kishin is correct. It might be hard to believe, but these women aren't actually robots, lol. Real people enjoy positve feedback and approval from real people - which is something money can't buy. A "thank you" here or "nice vid" there goes far. This is their job. For example, at my job, I do the best that I can. Of course I enjoy the money, but one thing that stands out to me this year was not any of my paychecks but getting a very unexpected certificate of appreciation from one of my supervisors from something I did (which was something I didnt even have to do.) I do things all the time at work that I don't have to and I'll still get paid the same even if I didn't do them. But knowing that people appreciate the extras of what I do motivates me to do it. If they didn't, I'd probably say f*** it too. I'm still getting paid. In their field, ASFR is probably an "extra" too. I'm guessing it's probably not their biggest moneymaker so they don't have to do it either. Let's all remember to give a little feedback. If anyone doesn't understand what makes a woman tick I will break it down for you: Using compliments, flattery and gratitude on these units are verbal authorization program codes. The more you use them, the more her pleasure programming responds to you. However, over time, not using these codes will trigger a glitch in their central processing unit, causing numerous errors and triggering these units to begin to malfunction and shut down beyond repair.

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Re: Content Creators Need Your Feedback.

Post by AmpFetish » Mon Nov 26, 2018 12:55 pm

I think on the whole, the fetish requires more than "Be born sexy and say/do this specific thing" like foot fetishes, or humping balloons or whatever, it's a lot harder to nail down.

I think 90% of filmed videos just suck. And I think the community knows this too. It's not really the creators' fault, it's just a difficult thing to get right. It requires great ACTING, VISUAL EFFECTS, PRACTICAL EFFECTS, EDITING, SOUND DESIGN, and so on, and so on. I'd say 90% of videos don't have that. I've sung his praises millions of times, but I think what the community is looking for is someone like Fection. That's the standard. Someone like that dude is a rare combo of creative skill + tastes that align with what the community wants. And people constantly BEG HIM for a new video. Ashley Fires had great skill, but her tastes didn't align with what I personally liked MOST of the time, so I canceled my subscription to her site. Most people probably did too.

Also, I think most of us like staying anonymous/silent because we live mostly normal lives and don't wanna get too entangled with a fetish community. A lot of us just want to look at decent porn every now and then. It's the same reason Pornhub videos have MILLIONS of views and like 100 comments. People don't wanna bother getting involved.

And my final point is that i think it's incorrect that we don't come out of the woodwork to sing the praises of people that make good videos. Like I said before, someone like Fection still gets massive feedback to this day. Most creators don't get that feedback because their videos don't really do anything for us, so most people don't care. If someone like AniErotika is begging for feedback, I don't want to sit down all the time and basically direct a video for her. People can get better, sure, but it's not my fault if I don't like what they're selling, even if they want to do well. If I don't like the videos, it's not my job to direct it and get exactly what I want. Because then I'd just get a custom. But I can't afford that either. So, I guess we just have to wait until someone orders a custom from a creator that ACTUALLY gets it.

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Re: Content Creators Need Your Feedback.

Post by Toastdroid » Mon Nov 26, 2018 4:08 pm

Robotman wrote:I need to clarify some thing again that people have either missed or chosen not to believe:

- The claim that creators are being driven away due to lack of feedback is not a judgement from Kishin or myself. This comes directly from a content creator.

Many people feel that they know better what this person has stated themself, so by all means, keep posting all about how this isn't true. Just remember that this is a public forum and everyone - including content creators - can see how dismissive you are of them.
I am aware. However, I did not really take much stock in that because:

1. A sample of one person is not enough to draw solid conclusion.

2. There's obviously a lot of producers (many mentioned in the OP) who have continued to to make content for years nearing to a decade despite this apparent feedback problem suggests otherwise.

3. Assuming the creator's complaints are valid, you do realise that the majority of sales for this person's content will have come from outside of this forum, right? And that surely means that this forum is at minimum partially not at fault.

4. Finally, there's the very real possibility that the person in question is the same one 33cl33 is talking about, and if so they may be driving feedback away because they're making people uncomfortable with repeated requests, which is a major breach of trust. Of course I can't be sure of this and I don't think it's fair to try and "out" this person either (so please don't).

My concerns are the same as a lot of people who have also posted here (most of whom also create content for this community, with no expectation of payment or feedback) - that, while it's totally fine to request politely for feedback (and every time someone done so to me I've gladly given it), and that it's nice to give unprompted feedback - it is absolutely not okay to demand it, especially when the content in question has been paid for. People have a right to enjoy things that they have paid for in private.

It is unfair and insulting to completely completely deflect those concerns, and suggest that we are somehow dismissive of the people who make this content; it is also highly unfair to hold us somehow responsible for a perceived lack of content, when many of us go out of our way to specifically pay for and commission this content.

That's the last I'm gonna say on the matter, since I've already wasted too much time on this.

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Re: Content Creators Need Your Feedback.

Post by daphne » Tue Nov 27, 2018 4:40 am

I think it's completely fair to out this person. I do not take OP's claim that there even is a complaint in the first place at face value. Show me the receipts.

KingJeremy

Re: Content Creators Need Your Feedback.

Post by KingJeremy » Tue Nov 27, 2018 5:47 am

daphne wrote:I think it's completely fair to out this person. I do not take OP's claim that there even is a complaint in the first place at face value. Show me the receipts.
While it's not my call to out the person, I can assure you that probably half of the people posting here know who it is, if not more. If so, it is not a stretch by any means to imagine said individual lodging this complaint.

I'll say this on the matter while I'm here. First and foremost, while it would be nice to see people give detailed feedback they should never feel obligated or be made to feel guilty about it if they don't. They've paid their money already and that is the most important feedback there is for a producer. In this particular case I think the producer has gone rogue and made several videos on their own and they are frustrated that they aren't getting feedback. Which I totally understand but as many have said before...this is life as a content creator in fembot land. They can at least track sales as some sort of metric. Most story writers, image manipulators and artists don't even have that to go off of.

In most (not all) cases these videos are either a custom or request so the only person whose opinion matters in that instance is the customer. The producer has made their money already, additional sales are icing on the cake but aren't what gets the video made in the first place.

I write to producers through email, message boards and social media constantly. I'm on good terms with several who are considered popular here and give suggestions all the time but the number one motivating factor for most is sales. They like to hear that people enjoyed it and some do take constructive criticism better than others, the ones I've spoken with about this very issue have said that sales determines if they make non commissioned videos in this genre.

tl;dr if you have time and the inclination to leave feedback, please do but in my experience a dollar is worth a thousand words in most cases.
Last edited by KingJeremy on Tue Nov 27, 2018 6:46 am, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: Content Creators Need Your Feedback.

Post by gyn2010 » Tue Nov 27, 2018 5:53 am

Maybe the solution to this problem is some kind of reverse engineering. Let everyone pick top three or four scenes as an examples and describe them in a short way.
I know everyone would give a different answer but maybe something will emerge out of this process.

1. Spilberg's AI. What really turned me on was an interaction between an android and an engineer. Crossing the line between human/robot twice. Loved visual effects too.
2. Ex Machina. Definatelly my type of stuff. You see the beauty of this movie for me lies in a simple fact, that even if some parts still sci-fi those robots were 100% technically reliable. Construction and designwise all was right.
3. Speaking of malfunctions they turn me on if there is "reveal" aspect in them. I love when a lady looking 100% human suddenly goes haywire or suddenly someone approaches her and i dunno detaches her arm like it's nothing special. That kind of thing. To give some examples of malfunctions: Cherry 2000, fection animations, FEMM-like moves and expressionless faces.

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Re: Content Creators Need Your Feedback.

Post by daphne » Tue Nov 27, 2018 6:45 am

Kishin wrote:
I do not take OP's claim that there even is a complaint in the first place at face value. Show me the receipts.
No, Daphne. I am not throwing a content creator under the bus for your amusement. Clearly you view all this as a spectacle to cackle over and laugh about with your friends.
I'm not going to give you the satisfaction of a named victim for your jeering and snark.

I find it amusing that you choose to call me a liar though. I've been part of the community and either contributed to or helped run its websites for 28 years. I've only ever had the community's best interests at heart.

But rather than see that, you choose to call me a liar and scorn me.
Spare me the "I've been with this community since you were in short pants" speech, chum. I've been with it just as long as you, if not longer. Back on the old IRC channel in the 90s I was known as MadScience. Heard from Cricket lately?

And I'm not calling you a liar. I'm calling you a hypocrite, because you've made the exact opposite argument on this very forum multiple times. Here's you telling Mirage (and the entire community you love "helping") "we're not here to stroke your ego" with feedback. Here's you again, back in the faraway date of literally this year, telling Uncom not to judge his success on feedback.

You gonna argue with yourself now?

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Re: Content Creators Need Your Feedback.

Post by daphne » Tue Nov 27, 2018 7:28 am

Robotman wrote:Daphne, what the hell is wrong with you?
I'm allergic to horseshit.

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Re: Content Creators Need Your Feedback.

Post by daphne » Tue Nov 27, 2018 7:39 am

FTR I genuinely couldn't care less if there's an actual message and/or who it's from. Maybe there is, maybe there isn't. It doesn't matter either way, because taking the entire community to task for one complaint is still a garbage argument.

KingJeremy

Re: Content Creators Need Your Feedback.

Post by KingJeremy » Tue Nov 27, 2018 7:50 am

daphne wrote:FTR I genuinely couldn't care less if there's an actual message and/or who it's from. Maybe there is, maybe there isn't. It doesn't matter either way, because taking the entire community to task for one complaint is still a garbage argument.
As you pointed out to Kishin, lack of feedback has been a thing for years upon years on this particular forum. It's frustrating. I've had a page outside of this community that I put time, effort and money into with very little feedback outside of a couple of producers and a couple of people I'd call friends. I don't update anymore but it's not because of a lack of feedback, I realize that's just the nature of this particular part of this fetish.

I think you're right about the OP, it came off a bit heavy handed if you didn't know specifically what was being relayed and RM has in all fairness tried to clarify in subsequent posts but this thread has kind of gone off the rails with a lot of different things being addressed.

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Re: Content Creators Need Your Feedback.

Post by Lithorien » Tue Nov 27, 2018 4:34 pm

Robotman wrote:Do you not understand that this person wished to remain anonymous? What makes you think your curiosity overrides their privacy?

The lack of empathy in this thread has been shocking.
RM, with all respect, it's almost impossible to show empathy or respect to someone who not only made an anonymous complaint, but to even react to a complaint that only one person - or maybe a few if Kishin shared - has even seen. Obviously Kishin isn't a liar, and we know you've got the best interests of the community at heart, but I think what a lot of people (self-inclusive) are taking umbrage to is that all we got was a, "This vague complaint has been levied against the community, and instead of doing any due diligence to find out how much of this is validated by other content creators, we're going to try to guilt and shame our community into 'fixing' this possible issue."

While it's great that you and Kishin want to take an active role as go-betweens, there's a reason that mediators are never part of the group they mediate for. It's too easy for the group to see them as traitors, or holding a conflict of interest, and interpreting everything said in a bad light because of that. You want to act as neutral third parties, but that's not a possibility: You're embedded in the community, like it or not, and your words to it hold more weight because of that reason.

I personally wish the anonymous sender had come out publicly and said, "I/we are having a feedback issue. I/we don't get X, Y, or Z that we would need to consider continuing with the community, and I/we'd love to open a dialogue to find out what's going on." Much cleaner conversation, it wouldn't have pit the community against itself, and everyone could have cleared the air without putting you or Kishin in a bad spot like you are now. Now mind you, if someone wanted to fracture the community, this is definitely the way to do it.

All that's left for me is to say that this has left a very bitter flavor in my mouth. It's why I rarely posted to Usenet and avoided IRC, and apparently has continued on to the forums and other community areas. Disappointing.

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Re: Content Creators Need Your Feedback.

Post by Barbarella » Tue Nov 27, 2018 7:33 pm

Lithorien wrote: RM, with all respect, it's almost impossible to show empathy or respect to someone who not only made an anonymous complaint, but to even react to a complaint that only one person - or maybe a few if Kishin shared - has even seen. Obviously Kishin isn't a liar, and we know you've got the best interests of the community at heart, but I think what a lot of people (self-inclusive) are taking umbrage to is that all we got was a, "This vague complaint has been levied against the community, and instead of doing any due diligence to find out how much of this is validated by other content creators, we're going to try to guilt and shame our community into 'fixing' this possible issue."
This... this all the way. I must have spent the better part of a grand in ASFR content all in all, and the money alone should be all the feedback that's needed. If a company's sales go down, what does that company do? They go on social media, and find out what's wrong, they go on facebook, forums, twitter, Instagram and take the pulse of the community they are serving. The ideas and content on this forum alone should have content creators making money hand over fist, but the fact is, a lot of those content creators do their own thing.

The major reason i stopped buying as many videos as i used to is down to poor recording, poor lighting, poor storyline and poor acting, the storyline and acting, if it was fixed, would make up for the poor recording and lighting, there is MORE than enough content on here for ideas. However a lot of the producers dont want to go down the roads on this forum, they want to do their own thing. I can relate to that since i used to be in the adult ent industry until a few years ago, however to make consistent money from a niche like ASFR the basics have to be nailed down. If we did leave feedback, im sorry, but a lot of it would be negative, the utter horseshit that makes up over half of that C4S thread is indicative of how bad some of the "content" has become, and to leave correct feedback, you need to buy the actual movie? Yeah, no, sorry, id rather just not buy anything anymore, been stung far too many times.
Robotman wrote:My original request in all this was for people to start being more interactive in general when it comes to content being produced. And I was talking mainly to the lurkers who never post, many of whom don't even have accounts here, and only browse these forums as "guests". There are a lot of them.
The fact they are buying content should be all the feedback needed. The fact they may stop buying the content is also all the feedback thats needed.
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Re: Content Creators Need Your Feedback.

Post by Ani Erotika » Wed Nov 28, 2018 6:56 am

A modest reply from me, a humble content creator, in the form of a free fun video for all to enjoy... :twisted:

https://www.manyvids.com/Video/969245/F ... OT-ADVERT/
Endeavouring to evolve into the ultimate fembot, with your help! :dancing:

Please check out my fembot videos on ManyVids and tell me what you think. <3

My homepage: Ani'z Korner :rockon:

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Re: Content Creators Need Your Feedback.

Post by Stephaniebot » Wed Nov 28, 2018 3:16 pm

Ani Erotika wrote:A modest reply from me, a humble content creator, in the form of a free fun video for all to enjoy... :twisted:

https://www.manyvids.com/Video/969245/F ... OT-ADVERT/
Stands up and applauds loudly. Absolutely brilliant, Ani, though I might have issues getting my cock out as requested! :lol:

Just loved the voice effects, the movements, and the attitude. Yes, I wished those voice effects had been available nearly 20 years ago, is all I can say!

:applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause:
I'm just a 'girl' who wants to become a fembot whats wrong with that?

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Re: Content Creators Need Your Feedback.

Post by Lithorien » Wed Nov 28, 2018 6:18 pm

Ani Erotika wrote:A modest reply from me, a humble content creator, in the form of a free fun video for all to enjoy... :twisted:

https://www.manyvids.com/Video/969245/F ... OT-ADVERT/
Ok, see, all jokes aside - This is all that was needed (not a comment on the form of it - the fact that you asked for reviews is what I'm referring to). Ani, if you want reviews and feedback, the community will be happy to give it to you if you ask... which you now have, and now we know that it's something you find valuable. Hell, I'll give you one on this particular video, with the caveat that yes, we're all aware that it was a tongue-in-cheek reply/admonishment. (Also a caveat that this is the first of your videos I've seen.)

The audio quality is very well done. You displayed a mastery of audio manipulation and vocal cadence that lends itself well to the genre and your audience. The stiff motions and deliberate movements were spot on, with little to no "bounce" that tends to be a dead giveaway on muscle control. The content isn't really fair to pass judgement on from a fetish standpoint, but it's obvious that you have the fundamentals down for content to be built upon. On a personal note, I'll need to actually give you more than a passing look; you seem like you could be a top creator.

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Re: Content Creators Need Your Feedback.

Post by Ani Erotika » Tue Dec 04, 2018 6:16 am

why thank you, lithorien.... truly, with all candor... appreciation for your response. i am getting a vision...... i think we shall be crossing paths, in times to come. going to be a fun, stimulating, and fascinating one.... ;) till then.... 8)
Endeavouring to evolve into the ultimate fembot, with your help! :dancing:

Please check out my fembot videos on ManyVids and tell me what you think. <3

My homepage: Ani'z Korner :rockon:

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